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War and Peace (Leo Tolstoy)

FollowingHim

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This is an incredible book, and does not fit into any standard category. It is a history of the Napoleonic wars in 1805 - 1813, but told from the perspective of the common man (the soldier in the thick of the action), with the ultimate aim of answering the very difficult question "why did hundreds of thousands of Christian men kill each other?".

The actions of the upper leadership of the nations involved (mostly France and Russia, but also Austria and Prussia), and the progress of the wars, major actions etc, are carefully researched accurate history. Every word said by an actual historical figure is quoted verbatim from a historical source.

However, the story is told from the perspective of regular people in the actual armies. The histories of such people are not recorded in detail. So the main characters of the story are fictitious. The author's father fought in these wars, he interviewed many others who fought in them, and himself participated in the later Crimean war, so from all this he was able to get an accurate picture of what it would have been like for people at the time. Each major battle is described through the eyes of somebody who is actually on the ground, during the action.

The focus of the story is to look at how it affects these individual people. The title, "War and Peace", reflects the fact that in the years covered, some years were at war and some were at peace. The lives of these individuals are followed through peacetime and war - a good third of the book is romance, romances that are followed through great trials and sometimes even death. This means we get a fascinating view of Russian feudal society in the early 19th century. The author was an excellent observer of people, and portrays people of quite different personalities and how they are changed by the experiences they go through over these years.

The main characters are in the lower nobility, so in peacetime they directly interact with everyone from peasents to royalty, illustrating the whole society. While in war, such people end up as junior officers - in the thick of the action commanding small units of men, but also with some interaction with the key leaders, once again giving an overview of the entire action.

But the story is just a setting in which to ask more fundamental questions. Who actually caused these wars? Why could one little man, Napoleon, tell 600,000 Christian men to go to war against other Christians, and have them actually obey him? What is power? How do leaders rise to power? Does a leader have their own power that they exert over the people, or do the people have a general will to do something and a leader arises who embodies that general will and leads the people to do what, on some level, they all already want to do? What drives history? What determines who will win a war? What level of control does a military commander really have, given no plan survives first contact with the enemy? The questions explored are wide-ranging, and deeply thought-provoking.

Over a hundred years before the Milgram experiments, Tolstoy comes to the same conclusions - that when people do something because they were ordered to do it, they do not feel responsible for it. Military structure involves a division of responsibility - the people doing the killing do not feel responsible for it (as they were just obeying orders), so do it. And the people giving the orders are removed from the actual killing, so also don't feel responsible. Tolstoy explores the nuances of this in great detail.

It all comes back to one overarching question - to what extent do we have free will, and to what extent are our actions and even thoughts predetermined and driven by external forces?

Finally - where does God fit into this? This is a very Christian book. Main characters go through very different story arcs, but ultimately find that a simple faith in Jesus is the thing that gives meaning to life, and allows them to cope with trials. Although the majority of the religion in the book is Orthodox Christianity (there are also Catholics, Protestants and Freemasons), and there is considerable Orthodox ritual involved in people's practice of their faith, fundamentally it is simplicity of faith in God that is prized above all ritual.

I cannot recommend this book highly enough.

It is
- An accurate history.
- A series of gripping, interlinking personal stories (romance and the trials of life).
- A treatise on philosophy, psychology, political science and religion - made accessible through all questions being placed in the context of a gripping story.

To fit that all in, the book is enormous. My copy is almost 1000 pages of fine print. That is because it's basically several books rolled into one. Every page is gripping however, once you start you won't want to put it down until the end.

Sadly it has nothing to do with polygamy, except that had one character been polygamous one poor lady would not have ended up a spinster, and through a good part of the story I was thinking "just take both of them, isn't it obvious?". But the characters wouldn't listen to me.
 
One thing he tries to do is to figure out the actual truth of what happened, behind the propaganda. A key example being the burning of Moscow.

The standard historical narrative (written by the winners as usual...) is that the Russians ran a scorched earth campaign, drawing the French army deeper and deeper into Russia but burning all resources ahead of them so they could not live off the land, ultimately burning Moscow so that the French could not benefit from it. Tolstoy looks behind this narrative and finds reality to be quite different.

The fires on Moscow started as or just after the French took over the city.

The French blamed the Russians for burning Moscow - they tried to put out the fires, and arrested and executed many people they accused of being arsonists.

The Russians initially blamed the French - saying that Napoleon had burned Moscow out of spite, because he was evil and destructive.

Then, later, the Russians changed their position and said that they had burned Moscow themselves in order to help defeat the French.

Tolstoy concludes that none of that is true, it's all propaganda, and the truth is likely far simpler. In a large city, there are several fires every day, which are put out by the firemen. When Moscow was abandoned, most but not all of the inhabitants fled (including most of the firefighters, who would have ridden off on the horses used to draw the fire engines...). Once the French came in the city was populated by soldiers (looting and living in houses) and the poor who had not fled. Inevitably fires would have started as they always do - but in those first few chaotic days there was no fire department, and no local government to organise one. So the usual fires were not put out but spread before the French could re-organise a firefighting service.

So he concludes Moscow burnt not because anyone intended to burn Moscow, but because it was inevitably doomed to accidentally burn simply due to the fact that it was abandoned.
 
It seems that FollowingHim thinks Russians are people, not demons. You aren't supposed to promote such ideas. 😉

There is a reason that Leo Tolstoy is widely regarded as one of the greatest writers ever. I haven't read War and Peace yet, but did really like Anna Karenina.
 
I read this book in my 20s while on a very long and boring deployment. It was excellent. I did have a false start as the first 100 pages were truly dense.
Yes, the beginning is dense, because it introduces so many characters in such a short time, and you keep trying to remember who they all are and get confused. It's a bit overwhelming, until you realise that you only actually need to pay attention to the Rostov and Bolkonski families, and Pierre. Once you figure out this subset of characters you actually have to remember and stop trying to remember all the others it becomes much easier reading.
 
Tolstoy is wrong.

I remember watching video on Youtube how this war was greatest military operation ever. Moscow from start planned Napoleon's destruction which included seizing Paris. Yes, Russian supreme command planned offensive over whole Europe.

It was Tzar who doomed Napoleon. He was unbreakable in forcing end of Napoleon's rule.

For nationalistic reasons Russians consider war over when French left Russian's territory. But this wasn't perspective of then Russian supreme command. For them end goal was always seizing Paris. Russian army did, in fact, followed Napoleon over Russian border. In fact, only reason Napoleon got a chance for recovery was error of supreme command.

Russian reserves were on training ground in Siberia. After Napoleon withdrawal it took reserves month(s) to walk to Europe to replace losses giving enough time to reconstruct his army. Remember, Russians were blooded very hard after winter of 1812.

I believe I heard this interview with Edward Luttwark.
 
Yes, the beginning is dense, because it introduces so many characters in such a short time, and you keep trying to remember who they all are and get confused. It's a bit overwhelming, until you realise that you only actually need to pay attention to the Rostov and Bolkonski families, and Pierre. Once you figure out this subset of characters you actually have to remember and stop trying to remember all the others it becomes much easier reading.
All the nicknames were tough too. You had to remember two or three names for every character.
 
Yes, the beginning is dense, because it introduces so many characters in such a short time, and you keep trying to remember who they all are and get confused. It's a bit overwhelming, until you realise that you only actually need to pay attention to the Rostov and Bolkonski families, and Pierre. Once you figure out this subset of characters you actually have to remember and stop trying to remember all the others it becomes much easier reading.
I got bogged down by all the names in the beginning and bailed when I started reading it a couple years ago. I should give it another go, remembering your tip. 👍
 
Tolstoy is wrong.

I remember watching video on Youtube how this war was greatest military operation ever. Moscow from start planned Napoleon's destruction which included seizing Paris. Yes, Russian supreme command planned offensive over whole Europe.

It was Tzar who doomed Napoleon. He was unbreakable in forcing end of Napoleon's rule.

For nationalistic reasons Russians consider war over when French left Russian's territory. But this wasn't perspective of then Russian supreme command. For them end goal was always seizing Paris. Russian army did, in fact, followed Napoleon over Russian border. In fact, only reason Napoleon got a chance for recovery was error of supreme command.

Russian reserves were on training ground in Siberia. After Napoleon withdrawal it took reserves month(s) to walk to Europe to replace losses giving enough time to reconstruct his army. Remember, Russians were blooded very hard after winter of 1812.

I believe I heard this interview with Edward Luttwark.
So Tolstoy was wrong because some dude on youtube said so?
Wrong about what, where?
Have you even read the book?

Incidentally, I never said he was 100% correct, no human would be, just that his book is well worth reading.
 
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So Tolstoy was wrong because some dude on youtube said so?
Wrong about what, where?
Have you even read the book?

Incidentally, I never said he was 100% correct, no human would be, just that his book is well worth reading.
Book ends too early. It should contain Cossack's entrance to Paris and Napoleon's abdication. That would be historal ending according to values of Russian ruling class who lived then and who made decisions.

Ending with French withdrawal reveals Tolstoy as Russian nationalist. Such ending creates perception that conflict was about survival of Russians as people, but Napoleon never cared about Russians as people, only them not trading with British. He on purpose cut war short in order to create historical fiction in order to better form Russian nation.
 
New Zealand gave them a taste of what dictatorship is like so they may as well stay where it's warm and oppressive as opposed to cold and oppressive.
Maybe New Zealand was worse.

In Russia they did try covid passports. Covid passports controllers were beaten and in one case knifed:

 
With regard to Covid NZ has certainly been worse than Russia. However, Russia has not been as good as their propaganda to the West tried to imply - throughout it all Putin has talked of freedom in his foreign speeches, while local administrations have put in place vax mandates. But ultimately the Russian people had more balls than the average New Zealander, and they didn't accept things that New Zealander's rolled over and obeyed. So it is less dictatorial, but due to the people's resistance, not necessarily due to a difference in government intent (intent is very hard to judge).
 
With regard to Covid NZ has certainly been worse than Russia. However, Russia has not been as good as their propaganda to the West tried to imply - throughout it all Putin has talked of freedom in his foreign speeches, while local administrations have put in place vax mandates. But ultimately the Russian people had more balls than the average New Zealander, and they didn't accept things that New Zealander's rolled over and obeyed. So it is less dictatorial, but due to the people's resistance, not necessarily due to a difference in government intent (intent is very hard to judge).
We Westerners really are soft and compliant people (even the loud mouthed gun toting Yanks).
 
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